Hi, everyone, and welcome back to Britain Under the Microscope. 欢迎回来【闲话英伦】. Hi, 安澜.

Hi, Lulu, hi, everyone.

In China we go to 民政局 for both getting married and getting divorced.

Yeah.

I know in the UK we talked about it for getting married. You have to go to like the council, sort of like the registry or like a civil...

You have to go to what is called the registry office.

The registry office.就登记大厅，就跟我们那个民政局差不多。

Yeah.

Is this the same place you go to when you want to get divorce?

No. No.

To get divorce, you can actually do it online or you can go to a family court.

Oh, I see, but either way you have to go to the court?

The court needs to grant the conditional offer and then you're given time, normally about I think it's 20 weeks before they finalize the divorce.

Is that a cool down period as well? 那个也是什么冷静期吗?

It’s normally a cool down period.

The idea of that period of time is to allow the husband and wife to discuss how best to proceed in terms of dividing assets.

Oh. The pragmatics.

It’s to allow them that time to plan what's gonna happen next. Because the reason why divorce can get very expensive is if both parties don't agree and then you get solicitors involved.

Lawyers.

Lawyers.

And both of you would get solicitors.

Exactly.

And then you fight for everything.

Yeah. And that's what can drag out a divorce case. So there are quite a few divorce cases where it's quite simple. They just say “okay, it's not working. You can take this, I'll take this, and that's it”. But obviously divorce sometimes it can't... divorce might not be that smooth.

Emm. Not that amicable.

Exactly.

This is what you were looking for.

Thank you.

But say, you don't want to get any solicitor. You shake on it and you say “okay. we get a divorce. That's fine. You have this. I have that. We have nothing to fight for. We don't have kids” and all that. If you don't get a solicitor, how much does the divorce cost?

It costs at least￡593.

That is very specific. It's oddly specific.

It is, but that's just for the court orders and for the certificate.

So you still have to go to the court.

You have to go before a court but it can be online or it can also be face to face.

That is a lot more expensive than a Chinese divorce, as the Chinese divorce is just that little booklet like a divorce certificate. By the way, do you get a divorce certificate?

We don't call it divorce certificate. We call it a final order or a decree absolute.

It sounds even more depressing than a divorce certificate if you ask me. 就是比离婚证 听起来感觉更悲惨更凄凉的感觉.

But exactly the same as in China, you need to keep it, so that if you want to remarry or you need to prove your marital status, you need to show that document.

Wouldn't they keep your divorce on record though?

They would, but you also need to have a copy of it yourself as well.

I see. I see.

And now let's talk about, you remember what we're talking about, why divorces can be really nasty, can be really difficult in any country, is because division of assets and also custody.

Yes.

就是离婚为什么那么难? 一个原因是division of assets就是分割财产, 还有一个就是custody, 如果有孩子的话, 孩子的这个监护权, 抚养权.

Yeah. So let's first of all, start with assets. So in the UK, assets are not automatically split 50% 50%.

This is the same in China, I think depends on we say过错方like who's, for example, who's been cheating.

Yeah.

Who's been committing domestic violence, for example.

Yeah, but remember that in the UK, divorce is no fault. So it's not that clear cut on how the assets are going to be divided.

So couples must agree on how to divide assets. If the couple doesn't agree, they can go through solicitors, they go through mediation, which is usually a free service. Or the final step is to ask for a judge to decide.

So the judge will personally decide.

Yes.

Oh, I see, but either way it will be a long, drawn out process I would assume.

Yes, it can be very very long and drawn out.

Emm, 安澜do you understand the idea of prenup? A prenuptial就是婚前协议.

Yes, yeah.

Do people sign that in the UK based on what you know?

Ah, I don't know to be honest. I would say probably do. But whether or not it's legally binding, I'm not too sure.

安澜 does not have enough assets to think about it.

I don't have enough assets to think about that. And also I should hasten to add, I'm not actually a lawyer or a solicitor.

Hahaha. All right, it's okay. It's just like, obviously we're talking about divorce these words just start popping up in my head.

Yes.

Yeah. Okay. So I was talking about prenup, 那个是婚前协议. And so that's assets and then the custody of a child, we talk about custody battle.

Yes.

孩子争夺战. Do you have any, I would assume it's roughly the same, like if the kid is really, really young, then it will automatically go to the mother, unless proven otherwise.

No.

Really?!

No.

So even if it's like a baby?

If it's a baby, it can go to the husband or it can go to the mother.

Based on what?

Based on equality. So children don't automatically go to the mother, or they don't automatically go to the father. Parents have to decide on the custody of the child.

Wow, okay, that's interesting. And I'm assuming it’s whoever gets the child, the other spouse, the other partner would have to pay for child support.

Yes. There are calculations for child support, and you can go on the government website, and it actually has what they would consider to be the fair amounts. And if you can't agree on child support, then the state or a judge would decide for you. And it's normally gonna be the same calculations as on that website.

The other thing is, the word does not really factor in Chinese marriage law, which is alimony, 我知道可能很多听我们节目的小伙伴会对这个比较感兴趣 ，就是alimony是对于前配偶的赡养费.

Yeah.

For example, after divorce, the man had to pay his ex-wife. We see this in movies TV shows all the time. It seems like many western countries have this alimony setting and the alimony can be extremely high.

In the UK we don't call it alimony, we call it maintenance, payments or maintenance support.

Maintenance support. 这个就是主要是给配偶，给前任配偶的这个赡养费。

And I've done my little research actually for this, and don't ask me why, but I've just done it out of curiosity. And it seems that in the UK it's not necessarily just men paying to the women.

I guess you.... like you said, for equality, it could also be women to her ex-husband. It depends on many many different situations. I think based on my research, the reason why there is alimony, it is to acknowledge the other person's contribution during the period of the marriage.

Yes. In the UK, it's very common to have what we call clean breaks. So a clean break means that all financial ties are ended. They all just come to an end, spousal maintenance or maintenance support is only paid when one partner can't support themselves financially without it.

主要是两个人经济悬殊特别大, 或者说是离了婚之后, 较弱的那一方是完全没有办法生活下去, 估计是为了不成为政府的负担, 所以就要有这个 alimony.

Yeah.

Either way, it's not as extreme as in some other countries.

No. No. So generally, if you've been together for a very, very, very long time, then probably the judge, if it gets to that level, then the judge will probably talk about spousal maintenance.

I see. And before we wrap this very long and slightly depressing topic up. Two more questions though, the first one is gay marriage is legal in the UK, right?

Yes.

Does that mean like a gay couple would have to go through exactly the same divorce procedures?

Exactly the same, sex marriage in the UK is completely legal and same sex divorce as well. It's exactly the same principle.

Okay. The other thing is, you know, that in China, there's a lot of controversy around this whole cool down period, 中国新婚姻法里面这个冷静期, 相信安澜也听到过。

Yeah.

So people have been having these controversial debates about it, mainly because they're asking what happens when one person is committing domestic violence within a marriage. What happens in the UK when that happened? Can divorce be granted immediately?

Divorce can't be granted immediately. But restraining orders and police action....

Oh.

can take place. So for example, if a man or woman are a victim of domestic violence, then what happens is the police can get involved. The other party can be arrested, or the judge can decide that a restraining order should be in effect.

所以如果有domestic violence家暴的情况下, 就可能会有restraining order, 就是这个叫禁制令, 意思就是说to keep this violent spouse away from you legally， to protect you, to protect your rights.

Yes.

Okay. And thank you for answering all my questions. I'm not gonna ask you to leave any comments about your own experience, because it's purely personal. But if you have any further questions, please leave a comment in the comments section. I'm sure 安澜 will do the research and answer.

Yes. I hasten to add I'm not actually a solicitor or a lawyer, so please do not listen to any advice that I give.

I'm pretty sure people won't.

I hope so.

All right, on that note, we're going to wrap up this episode. And thank you 安澜 for coming to the studio. And we'll see you next time.

Bye.

Bye.