Hi, everyone, and welcome back to Britain Under the Microscope. 欢迎回来【闲话英伦】. Hi, 安澜.

Hi, Lulu, hi, everyone. So, Lulu, what do you want to talk about today?

Tell you what, let's talk about divorce.

That's a very cheery happy subject.

It's a pragmatic subject.

I guess so.

We talked about marriage before, if you remember.

We did touch a little bit on divorce, but I don’t think we went into too much detail.

I think we're mostly focused on sort of like the happy wedding, newly weds and all that.

Well, I focused on that because I'm generally a happier person than you are.

Yeah. But let's talk about divorce nonetheless.

Okay.

I think divorce rate is extremely high in the UK, if I remember correctly.

It’s high, but it's actually at its lowest level since 1971.

Divorce rate?

The divorce rate.

In the UK.

But it's still quite high, 32% of marriages in the UK end in divorce.

32%, that's actually lower than I expected, to be honest.

How much is it in China? I can't remember.

You got me there. Actually, I don't know, but I think bits and pieces I've read it seems that the divorce rate in China now is higher than the UK, that's a depressing thought.

Yeah. I've seen different figures for China and I've also seen different figures for the UK, but it seems to be around the 32% mark that seems to be the most common.

Have you ever thought about the possibility of it dropping, like percentage-wise? It's just because fewer people get married nowadays.

Probably yeah, I think that does have a really strong impact, there's so many couples that are common in law.

Like common law marriage?

Yeah.

Civil partnership.

Not civil partnerships. That's slightly different.

OK, so common law就是事实婚姻那个概念, 对吧?

Yeah.

So, you live together, you just don't get that certificate.

That’s it. That's pretty much it.

For those of you who don't remember the marriage episode we did before. So, in the UK it is completely legal. I don't mean it that way, but like for two people to live together, they will have like the complete legal status as a married couple.

Pretty much.

I don't know the details of the law, but it's like, for example, for how long and how you are known to the neighbors.

It's also mostly around assets. So, if, for example, they break up who gets what assets.

You still have to divide the assets? 即使是这种同居的男女朋友, 只要是common law married, 他们之后分手的时候还是要分财产的. Exactly the same as a married couple.

Pretty much.

That's why some of my friends or friend’s friends in the UK, they've been together for decades. They just don't want that piece of paper.

No, and in the UK, there's no stigma for not getting married. It's just very, very common.

It's a personal choice.

It's a personal choice.

But we kind of digress, dialing back to divorce. So, you need to get married to get divorced, right? Yes. How easy it is for people to get divorced?

Now it's getting easier in a manner of speaking. I wouldn’t say easier in terms of, ok, I can just go and get divorce whenever I want, but the whole process is becoming a lot smoother. Particularly when we look at divorce in the past. Uh-huh. So, divorce in the UK was notoriously difficult in history. The most famous divorce was Henry VIII.

I knew you're going to mention Henry VIII. 这个是个很有名的例子, 就是亨利八世.the one who had six wives?

Yes, and he divorced his first wife Catherine of Aragon in 1533.

If I remember correctly, he wanted to divorce Catherine, he wanted to marry Anne Boleyn. That's correct. However, the Pope, the Catholic Church就是这个罗马教廷. They didn't really grant that divorce.

And that cause of Reformation in UK, when Henry VIII said, okay, the Pope won't give me a divorce. In that case, I'm gonna be the Head of the Church in England. And he completely changed the religion of England.

If you don't allow me to cheat on my wife and marry my mistress, then toodles to the Pope.

Exactly.

Reformation就是英国的那个时候的宗教改革. So that was Henry VIII then turned England from Catholic to Protestant. That's correct. 从 Catholic是天主教改成了新教Protestant.

He completely changed English history. That's all because of a divorce. But even after Henry VIII, you would think that the king got divorced, so it must be very easy for everyone. No, divorce was only for the very rich until the 20th century.

Why, did it cost a lot of money to get a divorce?

Not only did it cost a lot of money, but a couple needing a divorce had to get an act of parliament.

Every couple?!

Every couple had to actually take the divorce to parliament and parliament would agree.

Didn’t your parliament have anything better to do than like you're sitting there listen to the divorce gossip.

Not pretty much. That's why divorce was very, very rarely granted, because it required so much work, it required so much effort and also there was a social stigma.

Yeah, I mean nowadays in China, although divorce is getting, I wouldn't say popular, it’s getting more common, people still have that social stigma. We like to say we don't, but there's still social stigma.

Yeah. So, let's have a look at getting divorce. So, in England and Wales, I should say England and Wales because in Scotland it's slightly different. Scottish law is slightly different from English law, it is. So legally in England and Wales you can get a divorce after a year of marriage.

Hold on a minute. After a year of marriage, so within that year, you are not allowed to get the divorce?

You can get an annulment.

Annulment? Oh, I think some of our listeners probably heard that word in Friends. Yeah. When Rachel and Ross accidentally got married, when they were both drunk, they tried to get their marriage annulled. A-N-N-U-L-M-E-N-T.

Yes. So, annulment is a legal term. It basically means that the marriage never existed. But a divorce, the marriage existed, they were married.

Annulment就相当于宣告结婚证书无效. It basically invalidates that marriage. You still be unmarried. You will still be single. Exactly. But with a divorce you have got a divorce like that is in your records.

Exactly. So, to get a divorce, it's normally a year of marriage. Now the first step is to put in application and to get a conditional offer or a decree nisi.

OK. That is some grade A legalese. What does that mean in normal people term?

So, a conditional offer decree nisi basically means that the court sees no reason why a divorce can't be granted. The court is saying that you meet the conditions for a divorce. So, a divorce applies in your situation.

So, by the way, what are the reasons usually? I would assume that most people get divorced in any country for similar reasons.

I would say pretty much the same reasons. So, there's something called unreasonable behavior.

Unreasonable behavior would that include like domestic violence?

Yes. So, any behavior that is considered not ordinary, and then you have separation.

Separation就是分居and the couple don't live together.

Yeah. But if you live apart for about 2 years, then originally you could both agree to a divorce. But if you live apart for 5 years, then one party could actually just put in for a divorce, apply for a divorce.

So, the other party does not have to agree. 就分居5年一方就可以直接申请就离婚了，不用另外一方再同意。

That's right.

What about cheating? What about having an affair?

Adultery?

哦对，那个叫adultery.

That is also… that used to be one of the grounds for divorce. And desertion. Desertion? Yeah. So basically, if either the husband or wife runs away and disappears.

Oh, I see. But these are called grounds for divorce, like the reasons for divorce. Does that mean you need a reason to get divorced? Like if someone wants to get a divorce in the UK, and they have to show the court that I have these grounds, I have these reasons.

Not anymore. Originally, you had to have a reason to get divorce. But since 2022, English law now has the idea of No Fault Divorce.

No fault divorce, so, nothing drastic really happened, we just don't want to be together anymore.

Yeah. A couple doesn't need to give a reason for divorce. They just say we don't want to be together anymore. It's not his fault, it's not my fault, it's just not working.

中文我们就会说情感破裂. Marriage has broken down.

Exactly. And that's how we would say in English, a marriage breaks down.